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	<title>Comments for Roads from Emmaus</title>
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	<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org</link>
	<description>Place.  Communion.  Revelation.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 19:36:48 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by 尼克</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2948</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[尼克]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 19:36:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2948</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[FYI: All car rental companies do this, but if you book with a VISA card, they cover insurance, so you do not need to sign up for it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FYI: All car rental companies do this, but if you book with a VISA card, they cover insurance, so you do not need to sign up for it.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by Fr. Andrew Stephen Damick</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2946</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Fr. Andrew Stephen Damick]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 18:36:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2946</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yeah, that was pretty priceless, like it was something they just happened to observe.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, that was pretty priceless, like it was something they just happened to observe.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by B.E. Ward</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2945</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[B.E. Ward]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 18:33:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2945</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My favorite phrase in Dollar&#039;s response was &quot;...we are not showing a refund.&quot;

Of course you&#039;re not &quot;showing&quot; a refund!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My favorite phrase in Dollar&#8217;s response was &#8220;&#8230;we are not showing a refund.&#8221;</p>
<p>Of course you&#8217;re not &#8220;showing&#8221; a refund!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by David Dickens</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2944</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Dickens]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 15:32:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2944</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Incidentally, after being charged for gas from a Uhaul (when I did returned the vehicle with the same amount that was in it when I picked it up), I take a photo on my phone (time and date stamp) of the gauge and then again when I drop it off. 

I tell them I&#039;m doing this.

I haven&#039;t been charged for gas since. (and I&#039;ve never had to use the pictures)

It&#039;s a shame that people have to be so aggressive to protect themselves, but certain industries have (I can only assume) unreasonable price pressures. They simply cannot rent cars and stay in business at the prices they have to list, so they need to upsell just to keep the lights on. 

Other similar industries include healthcare (where they have to drastically over charge some to make up for others non-payment), car sales and long distance moving companies. I&#039;m sure there are others as well.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incidentally, after being charged for gas from a Uhaul (when I did returned the vehicle with the same amount that was in it when I picked it up), I take a photo on my phone (time and date stamp) of the gauge and then again when I drop it off. </p>
<p>I tell them I&#8217;m doing this.</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t been charged for gas since. (and I&#8217;ve never had to use the pictures)</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a shame that people have to be so aggressive to protect themselves, but certain industries have (I can only assume) unreasonable price pressures. They simply cannot rent cars and stay in business at the prices they have to list, so they need to upsell just to keep the lights on. </p>
<p>Other similar industries include healthcare (where they have to drastically over charge some to make up for others non-payment), car sales and long distance moving companies. I&#8217;m sure there are others as well.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by coffeezombie</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2943</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[coffeezombie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 15:26:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2943</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Fr. Andrew, you might enjoy this relevant &lt;a href=&quot;http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2010-07-13/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Dilbert comic strip&lt;/a&gt;.

Sadly, it&#039;s also pretty much spot-on. Unfortunately, in a bureaucracy , it can take a while to work your way up the chain to anyone who actually has power to do anything.

On another note the response you received for your original complaint actually very strongly reminded me of the letters I get whenever I write to my senators and congressman. Every time, I have written to ask them to oppose some particular bill. Every time, their form letter back starts with thanking me for contacting them, telling me how important it is for them to hear their constituents&#039; opinions, and then usually either proceeds to explain how important it is that this bill (that I am asking them to oppose) passes, or, even, goes on to talk about what a good track record they have in supporting the sort of thing I&#039;m asking them to oppose, as if that&#039;s what I want to hear!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fr. Andrew, you might enjoy this relevant <a href="http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2010-07-13/" rel="nofollow">Dilbert comic strip</a>.</p>
<p>Sadly, it&#8217;s also pretty much spot-on. Unfortunately, in a bureaucracy , it can take a while to work your way up the chain to anyone who actually has power to do anything.</p>
<p>On another note the response you received for your original complaint actually very strongly reminded me of the letters I get whenever I write to my senators and congressman. Every time, I have written to ask them to oppose some particular bill. Every time, their form letter back starts with thanking me for contacting them, telling me how important it is for them to hear their constituents&#8217; opinions, and then usually either proceeds to explain how important it is that this bill (that I am asking them to oppose) passes, or, even, goes on to talk about what a good track record they have in supporting the sort of thing I&#8217;m asking them to oppose, as if that&#8217;s what I want to hear!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by (Tasoni)</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2942</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[(Tasoni)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 14:10:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2942</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[We recently rented a car (something we have done a few times before), and I noticed that the upsell was pretty tricky and pushy. After being very sweet and giving us all bottles of water and treating us like old friends, the saleswoman proceed to tack on more and more expenses (that we politely declined). &quot;Without the insurance, you will to be responsible for any damages to the car!!&quot; Yep, we can handle that. 

She did manage to sell us on half a tank of fuel (so we wouldn&#039;t have to fill the car before we brought it back), and then her coworkers tried to push us into a gas-guzzler (&quot;at no extra cost!&quot;) on our way out. 

I think experience is the best teacher. Your rental experience is not unusual. You just didn&#039;t know any better :). I would fare as well if I tried to &quot;negotiate&quot; the price of a car purchase or haggle over an antique. I think you&#039;re at least partly annoyed that you got taken... That is the nature of the business ;).

Ironically, I just wrote a post about how we treat people with accents.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We recently rented a car (something we have done a few times before), and I noticed that the upsell was pretty tricky and pushy. After being very sweet and giving us all bottles of water and treating us like old friends, the saleswoman proceed to tack on more and more expenses (that we politely declined). &#8220;Without the insurance, you will to be responsible for any damages to the car!!&#8221; Yep, we can handle that. </p>
<p>She did manage to sell us on half a tank of fuel (so we wouldn&#8217;t have to fill the car before we brought it back), and then her coworkers tried to push us into a gas-guzzler (&#8220;at no extra cost!&#8221;) on our way out. </p>
<p>I think experience is the best teacher. Your rental experience is not unusual. You just didn&#8217;t know any better <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> . I would fare as well if I tried to &#8220;negotiate&#8221; the price of a car purchase or haggle over an antique. I think you&#8217;re at least partly annoyed that you got taken&#8230; That is the nature of the business <img src='http://s1.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> .</p>
<p>Ironically, I just wrote a post about how we treat people with accents.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by Jason</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2941</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jason]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 13:05:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2941</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hard to trust a company that uses a fallen cross with the word &quot;Dollar&quot; on it as its logo. 

I feel for those working in that line of work. They almost always hate their job and only took it because it pays a wage and gives some sort of benefits, although both are probably meager.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hard to trust a company that uses a fallen cross with the word &#8220;Dollar&#8221; on it as its logo. </p>
<p>I feel for those working in that line of work. They almost always hate their job and only took it because it pays a wage and gives some sort of benefits, although both are probably meager.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by cchittom</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2940</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[cchittom]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 02:46:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2940</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;But I do hope I might appeal not to your sense of legality here but rather of simple, basic courtesy and humanity (even if not morality). &quot;

My sense is that a corporation, as such, cannot be a moral actor since&#8212;as a legal fiction&#8212;it does not actually exist.  Likewise, it can be neither courteous nor humane.  (Individual employees may be any of those, of course.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;But I do hope I might appeal not to your sense of legality here but rather of simple, basic courtesy and humanity (even if not morality). &#8221;</p>
<p>My sense is that a corporation, as such, cannot be a moral actor since&mdash;as a legal fiction&mdash;it does not actually exist.  Likewise, it can be neither courteous nor humane.  (Individual employees may be any of those, of course.)</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by jamesthethickheaded</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2939</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jamesthethickheaded]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jun 2013 01:26:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2939</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The premium we pay in some places allows for the fixing of mistakes at their expense. This is the meaning of the laborer is worthy of his wage... or Tobit&#039;s admonition to pay a wage immediately. I&#039;m increasingly happy to pay a slight premium to work with human beings... who understand that&#039;s what the customer is, too. In the long run, it ends up cheaper. But no, standard industry practice is a day is a day is a day... 24 hours and it&#039;s EXTREMELY rigid. But I&#039;ve felt you pain... usually on the gas tank issue (fill or don&#039;t). Never seem to stop learning how you can be gamed. Truth is that the low-ball price guys are the ones that force the majors who charge more to start playing these games. In the end the range of behavior narrows as it does in any &quot;game&quot;. Talk to taxi drivers and learn how impossible it is for them to make a living and you&#039;ll understand how the market for &quot;limos&quot; has taken off... as an independent driver&#039;s attempt to circumvent poor prospects for making ends meet. Here again, the high end and low end are narrower in price than was once the case, and competition is shifted to non-price amenities... like AC that works, seats that don&#039;t stick to you, etc.

All that said, I would encourage you to not be embarassed to take your complaint to the top. I had an on-line issue the other day with my natural gas company and couldn&#039;t get out of a horrible response cycle, so went to the Investor Contact page on their website. Have done the same with Verizon on occassion, too. In all cases, keeping it professional and trying to sell them on fixiing the problem as a system issue... and not personal, but something in their interest to fix... then you&#039;ll get a response. I&#039;ve had VERY personal service as a result, phone calls from senior management, etc. Sometimes they can&#039;t fix it... but at least they tried... and maybe it will work for the next person somewhere. 

Then direct your business where they seem to see things your way everywhere you can. Value people, the environment, products that endure, etc. ...all of these or take your  pick... whatever... but don&#039;t buy like the horde that divorces themselves from playing a role. Care. The market is a place where we vote with our dollars... only most folks refuse to see it that way. And sometimes, frankly... the market fails. The market has been annihilated by the impact of desperate labor conditions and rigid, shoddy production... and become accustomed to shoddiness it previously wouldn&#039;t tolerate. And it&#039;s not just the Chinese we complain about... but the whole of EVERYwhere... even here. 

So you touch a nerve. If only you knew the whole of it. And yeah... the saddest part is most folks listen to my case here... which I don&#039;t make very well, shake their heads and maybe acknowledge the problem, but then go ahead and buy on price alone as if it weren&#039;t connected to quality, to a way of life, a way of consumption and a way of killing us softly.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The premium we pay in some places allows for the fixing of mistakes at their expense. This is the meaning of the laborer is worthy of his wage&#8230; or Tobit&#8217;s admonition to pay a wage immediately. I&#8217;m increasingly happy to pay a slight premium to work with human beings&#8230; who understand that&#8217;s what the customer is, too. In the long run, it ends up cheaper. But no, standard industry practice is a day is a day is a day&#8230; 24 hours and it&#8217;s EXTREMELY rigid. But I&#8217;ve felt you pain&#8230; usually on the gas tank issue (fill or don&#8217;t). Never seem to stop learning how you can be gamed. Truth is that the low-ball price guys are the ones that force the majors who charge more to start playing these games. In the end the range of behavior narrows as it does in any &#8220;game&#8221;. Talk to taxi drivers and learn how impossible it is for them to make a living and you&#8217;ll understand how the market for &#8220;limos&#8221; has taken off&#8230; as an independent driver&#8217;s attempt to circumvent poor prospects for making ends meet. Here again, the high end and low end are narrower in price than was once the case, and competition is shifted to non-price amenities&#8230; like AC that works, seats that don&#8217;t stick to you, etc.</p>
<p>All that said, I would encourage you to not be embarassed to take your complaint to the top. I had an on-line issue the other day with my natural gas company and couldn&#8217;t get out of a horrible response cycle, so went to the Investor Contact page on their website. Have done the same with Verizon on occassion, too. In all cases, keeping it professional and trying to sell them on fixiing the problem as a system issue&#8230; and not personal, but something in their interest to fix&#8230; then you&#8217;ll get a response. I&#8217;ve had VERY personal service as a result, phone calls from senior management, etc. Sometimes they can&#8217;t fix it&#8230; but at least they tried&#8230; and maybe it will work for the next person somewhere. </p>
<p>Then direct your business where they seem to see things your way everywhere you can. Value people, the environment, products that endure, etc. &#8230;all of these or take your  pick&#8230; whatever&#8230; but don&#8217;t buy like the horde that divorces themselves from playing a role. Care. The market is a place where we vote with our dollars&#8230; only most folks refuse to see it that way. And sometimes, frankly&#8230; the market fails. The market has been annihilated by the impact of desperate labor conditions and rigid, shoddy production&#8230; and become accustomed to shoddiness it previously wouldn&#8217;t tolerate. And it&#8217;s not just the Chinese we complain about&#8230; but the whole of EVERYwhere&#8230; even here. </p>
<p>So you touch a nerve. If only you knew the whole of it. And yeah&#8230; the saddest part is most folks listen to my case here&#8230; which I don&#8217;t make very well, shake their heads and maybe acknowledge the problem, but then go ahead and buy on price alone as if it weren&#8217;t connected to quality, to a way of life, a way of consumption and a way of killing us softly.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Priest vs. Machine: Dollar Rent A Car as an Emblem of Bureaucratic Nihilism by Chris Jones</title>
		<link>http://roadsfromemmaus.org/2013/06/03/priest-vs-machine-dollar-rent-a-car-as-an-emblem-of-bureaucratic-nihilism/#comment-2938</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris Jones]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jun 2013 21:24:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadsfromemmaus.org/?p=2561#comment-2938</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mr Rice

Do you sit down and read the rental contract thoroughly before you sign it, every time you rent a car?  I suspect that in most cases your reservation will expire and they will rent your car to someone else before you have finished doing that.

In the real world, the purpose of the contract is to spell out the terms of the deal in excruciating legal exactitude, in order to protect the interests of the rental agency -- not the renter.  Nobody reads the contract, but every renter signs the contract knowing that that is what the contract is for, because the alternative is to decide not to rent the car, not to improve the terms of the contract in the renter&#039;s favor.  The language of the contract is not negotiable; it&#039;s take it or leave it.

Given that, it&#039;s the rental agent&#039;s job to tell the renter in plain English what the substance of the deal is.  That is not a legal responsibility (the contract takes care of that), it&#039;s a market-driven, customer service responsibility.  Because if the agent misrepresents the contract or misleads the renter into accepting and paying for services he does not need or want, that renter is going to take his custom elsewhere.  As Fr Andrew evidently will do.

I don&#039;t know how many priests you have known, but if you feel that &quot;priests are the most arrogant people I have ever met&quot; then you have had very bad luck in your clergy acquaintances.  I have known many, many priests and pastors in my nearly 60 years, including Orthodox priests since I was Orthodox for ten years. In my experience most Christian clergy are reasonably confident within their expertise (theology, homiletics, and pastoral care), but personally gentle and unassuming men.  I have known a few who obviously thought that they were God&#039;s gift to His Church, and willing to be the expert and the one in charge about everything; but such men are definitely the exception.


Fr Andrew,

I travel a good deal on business and have much experience with renting cars.  It can be aggravating to rent a car, but experiences like the one you had are pretty rare.  Most rental agents will initially run through their script as quickly as can be, but if you stop and ask them to slow down and explain things in detail, they will do so and be quite helpful.

As it happens, one of the few bad experiences that I have had was with Dollar, though it was not as bad as yours.  I had a blowout while driving a Dollar rental, and they charged me $150.00 for replacing the tire.  I tried to convince them that losing a tire constituted &quot;normal wear and tear&quot; and thus was part of their cost of doing business.  They would have none of it, and of course the language of the contract that I had signed supported their position.  I paid the $150.00 under protest, and asked my credit card company to go to bat for me.  It took several weeks, but they got me my $150.00 back.

Next time you have to rent a car, go with Enterprise, Avis/Budget, or National.  They have always been good to me.  (Hertz is good too, but they are always the most expensive.)

Oh, and always pay for your rental with American Express.  They&#039;ve got your back.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr Rice</p>
<p>Do you sit down and read the rental contract thoroughly before you sign it, every time you rent a car?  I suspect that in most cases your reservation will expire and they will rent your car to someone else before you have finished doing that.</p>
<p>In the real world, the purpose of the contract is to spell out the terms of the deal in excruciating legal exactitude, in order to protect the interests of the rental agency &#8212; not the renter.  Nobody reads the contract, but every renter signs the contract knowing that that is what the contract is for, because the alternative is to decide not to rent the car, not to improve the terms of the contract in the renter&#8217;s favor.  The language of the contract is not negotiable; it&#8217;s take it or leave it.</p>
<p>Given that, it&#8217;s the rental agent&#8217;s job to tell the renter in plain English what the substance of the deal is.  That is not a legal responsibility (the contract takes care of that), it&#8217;s a market-driven, customer service responsibility.  Because if the agent misrepresents the contract or misleads the renter into accepting and paying for services he does not need or want, that renter is going to take his custom elsewhere.  As Fr Andrew evidently will do.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know how many priests you have known, but if you feel that &#8220;priests are the most arrogant people I have ever met&#8221; then you have had very bad luck in your clergy acquaintances.  I have known many, many priests and pastors in my nearly 60 years, including Orthodox priests since I was Orthodox for ten years. In my experience most Christian clergy are reasonably confident within their expertise (theology, homiletics, and pastoral care), but personally gentle and unassuming men.  I have known a few who obviously thought that they were God&#8217;s gift to His Church, and willing to be the expert and the one in charge about everything; but such men are definitely the exception.</p>
<p>Fr Andrew,</p>
<p>I travel a good deal on business and have much experience with renting cars.  It can be aggravating to rent a car, but experiences like the one you had are pretty rare.  Most rental agents will initially run through their script as quickly as can be, but if you stop and ask them to slow down and explain things in detail, they will do so and be quite helpful.</p>
<p>As it happens, one of the few bad experiences that I have had was with Dollar, though it was not as bad as yours.  I had a blowout while driving a Dollar rental, and they charged me $150.00 for replacing the tire.  I tried to convince them that losing a tire constituted &#8220;normal wear and tear&#8221; and thus was part of their cost of doing business.  They would have none of it, and of course the language of the contract that I had signed supported their position.  I paid the $150.00 under protest, and asked my credit card company to go to bat for me.  It took several weeks, but they got me my $150.00 back.</p>
<p>Next time you have to rent a car, go with Enterprise, Avis/Budget, or National.  They have always been good to me.  (Hertz is good too, but they are always the most expensive.)</p>
<p>Oh, and always pay for your rental with American Express.  They&#8217;ve got your back.</p>
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